Quicksand Made Illegal!

[stevensenechal]

Has the topic of trespassing on private property or closed areas ever been discussed in this forum? Obviously the moderators would never condone acts contrary to law ( as the act of trespass has a place in the realm of fantasy stories purely as a plot device ) but avid explorers have had to contend with this 'moral' dilema ( that should ruffle a few feathers ). The very act of sinking raises rescue issues ( and their costs ) in the mind of an unknowing public and qs seekers no doubt have had to contend with a wide variety of other perils related to the very act of reaching their destinations ( the landowner waving a shotgun at a near-naked mud creature comes to mind ).
I have noticed that this particular forum has attracted those whose penchants tend to range from the relatively benign to, well , the exotic. It would be interesting to hear a wide spectrum of opinions on this topic. Some might say the strong do what they want but I would be interested to here from the meek as well.....after all the meek will inherit.....

[Fred588]

While I am heavily involved in the world of quicksand, I am not a 'sinker,' so the issue of sinking on private property would not really come up for me other than by accident. However, I have been (and still am to some extent) an avid caver (explorer of caves). It is a matter of course that cavers do not enter a cave without the permission of the landowner. [The owner of the land containing the entrance, that is.] To do so would clearly be trepassing. Therefore, my opinion is that the two situations are little different. It makes no difference whether the landowner is a private citizen, a company, or a governmental entity.

There may be cases, of course, in which crossing a piece of property that could contain quicksand is permitted. For example, the shoreline below the high water mark is generally considered open to passage in most places. In that case, an encounter with quicksand would not be illegal (in and of itself). Entering a patch of mud would be hardly different from entering the water.

Has the topic of trespassing on private property or closed areas ever been discussed in this forum? Obviously the moderators would never condone acts contrary to law ( as the act of trespass has a place in the realm of fantasy stories purely as a plot device ) but avid explorers have had to contend with this 'moral' dilema ( that should ruffle a few feathers ). The very act of sinking raises rescue issues ( and their costs ) in the mind of an unknowing public and qs seekers no doubt have had to contend with a wide variety of other perils related to the very act of reaching their destinations ( the landowner waving a shotgun at a near-naked mud creature comes to mind ).
I have noticed that this particular forum has attracted those whose penchants tend to range from the relatively benign to, well , the exotic. It would be interesting to hear a wide spectrum of opinions on this topic. Some might say the strong do what they want but I would be interested to here from the meek as well.....after all the meek will inherit.....

[Nessie]

My current sinking spot (see last clip) is in a wildlife management area. The public is allowed in from sunrise to sunset. Dogs are also allowed in so long as they are leashed. Motorized vehicles on trails are prohibited. Taking of non-protected wildlife is prohibited until September (so there is no hunting there now), and target practice (shooting at things other than legal game) is not allowed at any time. One may pick edible or decorative plants for one's personal use, except for wild rice, throughout the year. Hunting equipment, such as duck blinds and deer stands, when in season, may not be left there overnight.

I find it advantageous to choose mudpits on public land, and I do read all the signs at every site to ensure that I don't do anything conspicuously stupid to attract attention and get myself kicked out.

So far I've not bumped into any STAY OUT OF THE MUD signs although I am pretty sure that the only reason for that is, they haven't yet realized that anybody has ever been in it.

Nessie

[nachtjaeger]

Being a great fan of old-fashioned concepts like private property, I confine my sinks to either my own land or public lands.

Still, in some countries (Scotland comes to mind) they have a "right to roam" law, where if one is simply walking across someone else's property (not camping, hunting, cutting firewood, etc.) it's perfectly legal. And if one "happened" to stumble into a bog. . .

It would be nice to have that here if the liability issues for landowners could be fixed. I don't like the idea of being sued for megabucks by a trespasser who tripped over a blade of grass and bruised his ego. Unfortunately, the politicians and trial lawyers are either thick as thieves, or (in the case of New York's part-time legislature) the same people.

[Mynock]

Technically, I'm trespassing when I go sinking. I tracked down the owner of the quarry and asked his permissing to go mudding in there with my friends and their trucks/ATV's (I actually do use the place for that purpose as well). He said he didn't care but if we get hurt he'll tell the cops we didn't have permission to be in there so he doesn't end up sued.
I used to go in there without permission, but to be honest, I felt kind of bad about doing it. I'm no straight edge but I try to obey the law when I can.

[stefani_tg]

have to fess to trespassing a few times... my best sink was on public lands but a few were on properties - a coupla quarries and a fenced off pond which had become filled with leaves which rotted into a soft muck. it was early on a weekend and i'd found it while walking on nearby public paths and just had to find out more... sadly i was too scared to be caught as the owner's dogs were barking away in house a few hundred yards away (not sure if cos of me) and idea of being in the mud if they - and owner - suddenly appeared...

[dougiezerts]

Of course, the best solution is to make your own mud pit in your backyard! Not always doable, admittedly.

[mudxdresser]

For those for whom outdoor mud is a way of life, there is no escaping the sad fact that most of the best mud is associated with some sort of quarry operation. And for some decades now it has been effectively impossible for a landowner to give permission for an activity involving their mud ponds without losing their insurance coverage because of the skill exhibited by the legal profession in overcoming supposedly binding contracts and covenants not to sue.

You get two choices. Go through life missing out on all the really great mudpits or, well, let's just say those who don't miss out are generally known on the mud network as "quarrymen" and let it go at that as "quarrymen" are generally best advised to refrain from making written confessions on the Internet that might be attributed to them!...

[tempman]

It's legal around here, though the moors are privately owned us pedestrians have the right to use them. But it also happens that every Thursday during this time of the year the owners come up to shoot pheasant. So I don't like to go then

[Mwam]

Well, i used to go sinking in public places, but sometimes i went tresspassing....

I knew a cool gravel pit, with big lakes, and deep soft mud/qs, wich is really cool. The only thing that could be risk the guards, but fortunately, they used to go there only 1 times /2-3 weeks. And - i was suprising when i was there in the first times - that place is really popular!

My other "tresspassing" place is a claypit, which really deep. The signs on the edge shows: "Mining area, don't tresspassing", but after you walking down - wich is easy and sometimes motorcyclers, and ATW riders be there - the other sign says: "Mine lake, swimming is forbidden"
Anyway, the lake is really clearm and some pert os it not deep, and it's temperature is perfect, so i can cleaning up myself after sinking/mudding.

I think this kind of tresspassing - what we sinkers do - is risky but exciting.