I am Charlie

[bfc796]

I am not 'shilling for the enemy' and take an extremely dim view of Muslim fanaticism and other assorted religious nonsense - I am not an apologist for anyone. I would deport them all off-world to their own planet if it was in my power. The fewer fervent ideologues in the world, the better.

[kham]

Oooo
Look Everybody!
It learned how to use the edit function!

You know, how like the fucktard NYT, you removed your post where you posited that somehow, agents of Mossad were involved, some sort of secret agent mission....

Sunshine, that only works when your oppo is retards and doesn't know how to read

[bfc796]

I don't think you realise how you demean yourself by resorting to such invective. It is most unedifying and indicative of a lack of maturity (i.e, a bit childish).

Referring to someone as 'it' is pretty revealing, too... How old are you again? 52?

The post you refer to vanished - the fact you saw it proves it was published. I PM'd Viridian to enquire as to whether it had been moderated or not. I don't know what happened to that.

Regarding the direction this conversation is heading in... Pitchforks at the ready... OMG, someone here doesn't adhere to the prevailing consensus - sound the alarm! You can report me to the Ministry of Truth for re-education.

[nachtjaeger]

Imagine if Wiccans rioted every time somebody published an image of the green-faced ugly old witch. And I'm not quite sure why militant Christians haven't killed the entire cast, crew, and writers of "Monty Python's Flying Circus" and the movies. "Life of Bryan" should have touched off a Crusade against Britain.

Theoden: So much death. What can men do against such reckless hate?

Aragorn: Ride out with me. Ride out and meet them.

Theoden: Let this be the hour when we draw swords together. Fell deeds, awake! Now for wrath, now for ruin, and the red dawn. Forth, Eorlingas!

[bfc796]

Yes, I thought of Monty Python too (Life of Brian, Holy Grail) - when confronted with wannabe fascists with ugly delusions, who are claiming divine authority; the appropriate response is laughter, mockery, ridicule and satire. Organized religion should not be taken seriously or afforded respect of any kind, but unfortunately Governments and Media in the West give it the veneer of respectability, which then informs public opinion. Where is Christopher Hitchens when you need him? Gone way too soon. The only qualitative difference between a cult like Scientology and an the three monotheistic religions (Judaism, Christianity and Islam) is scale and mainstream respectability. As I mentioned in another thread, I am an agnostic secular humanist. The teachings of Jesus Christ were great (love thy brother as thyself), but institutionalised dogmatic beliefs systems are not great. Satire seems to be on the wane, worryingly - I lament the passing of Spitting Image, 2DTV and Monkey Dust (British TV). HIGNFY is still going, but it's relatively tame these days.

Christopher Hitchens Revises the Ten Commandments - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9weXGtCk7c

The other thing that's always puzzled me, given the hostility that ordinary non-radicalised Muslims in the UK and US must have faced during the last 10+ years, is: why are they not organizing themselves to publicly disown the terrorist acts being committed in their name en masse? There should be 1m plus rallies of Muslims marching for peace in major cities (especially London and New York, for obvious reasons), but there aren't (possibly due to fears of agent provocateurs derailing it). This used to make me think that ordinary Muslims inwardly sympathise with fundamentalist Islam, and I still wonder about that. The onus is on them to say, in unison - these fanatics don't represent us! Perhaps the Muslim Council of Britain is engaged in campaigning for peace, but it isn't being reported. Believers in Islam giving voice to such sentiments do seem to be conspicuous by there absence in the public arena, with predictable results.

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2013 ... rime-soars

[Aiko]

Perhaps the Muslim Council of Britain is engaged in campaigning for peace, but it isn't being reported.

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/fraser-nel ... -shooting/

... used to make me think that ordinary Muslims inwardly sympathise with fundamentalist Islam, and I still wonder about that.

... which makes it a preconception on your part and therefore your problem. It should be obvious that these nut-jobs do not represent the majority of Muslims living peacefully all over the world. The shooting should not concern them any more or less than the rest of us. So if they saw a need to raise their voice against these extremists, the best thing to do would be joining one of the numerous demonstrations in France or other places - united with others who believe in the importance of Free Speech rather than separately from them.

[bfc796]

It should be obvious that these nut-jobs do not represent the majority of Muslims living peacefully all over the world.

Yes, I agree that this should be self-evident, but apparently it's not an obvious enough distinction for everyone to draw, in light of the soaring rate of crimes being committed against peaceful members of the Islamic faith.

I was putting myself in the shoes of a moderate Muslim, imagining how unpleasant that experience must have been during the last decade (sensing the almost palpable hostility, the shitty looks, etc), and then thinking how I would be at pains to emphasise that I do not in any way condone, endorse or approve of violence in the name of Religion - I would want people to understand that this is being done 'not in my name'. The distinction between them and a tiny minority of extremists is not delineated clearly enough to impact upon mainstream public consciousness (breeding suspicion and fear), hence attacks on totally innocent blameless people merely out of association with atrocities that have been committed in the name of their faith. Those acts need to be condemned in the strongest terms possible by those seeking to rightly disassociate themselves from them. Avoiding the prospect of being an unjustified target of hate crime would certainly motivate me to do so.

[Mynock]

Yup. Just a suicide bombing here...and destroying other religions artifacts there.....and a stoning for refusing an arranged marrige here.....and running over their own kids with their car because they think they've become too westernized here in the states......just one guy attacking cops with an ax in NYC.....just a couple gunning people down at a news paper in Paris.....I could go on probably for hours but do i really need to?
How many times do "just one or two radicals" have to do this shit before you wake up and realize they're all in on it? The difference between a moderate muslim and a radical muslim is the latter does the killing and the former provides moral or logistical support. A dozen people bullshit you on twitter and you're like "oh I guess it makes 14 dead people ok then."
But by all means, bury your head in the sand. Maybe having it cut off will hurt less if you don't see it coming.

[dlodoski]

I was reading an article about why Muslims are so sensitive to satire.

A Muslim scholar/media type said something to the effect that "When you are being persecuted, these things hurt".

WTF? The Palestinian issue aside (small potatoes for anyone who gets the bigger picture), Muslims are the ones attacking innocents in the name of religion, literally, all over the world. IMO, Christians are the most persecuted religious group on the planet right now.

I know it's not my place to comment on these discussions, but like Mynock said, we are at war, like it as not.

[bfc796]

Mynock, I share your reservations and sincerely hope we are both wrong on that (otherwise the world is in an even bigger mess than I thought) - I'm giving moderate Muslims the benefit of the doubt, but there is doubt.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-30744693

This is happening in Space Year 2015? WTF?