Advice needed- question on leaving Deviant Art for here

[Rusty Shackleford]

So I'd like to solicit opinions about whether I should leave Deviant Art and start posting all of my stuff here. Let me preface this by saying this is not about not getting feedback, views or anything of the such. Its more that I'm getting a little paranoid about Deviant Art as I see a number of artists who I really respect either leaving or being banned (e.g. Acidtester, not sure what happened there but it gives pause for concern). I started posting at Deviant Art because I wanted to branch out a little more, particularly that I wanted to do some non-linear story telling with comics (something that needed multiple pages so you could link to different pages of the story like flipping through a book, which I didn't think was possible here). I did that and was pretty happy with the result, which also let me explore some other topics (like vore, plants, etc) that would be off-limits here. But I find that the majority of stuff I still do is QS related, as that's my primary interest. I'm still worried about how that stuff is received there (particularly by moderators) and the ability of search engines to pick that stuff up. It seems that stuff here is not picked up by search engines (which I note with a little irony because right now the site says there is a Bing Bot reviewing stuff).

I figure that everyone who is at Deviant art looking at my QS stuff is already here. After all, this is the best site on the internet for us, run by people who understand us, and I should thank them every chance I can for giving us this opportunity to share a common interest. So I would actually be sharing with the people most interested in seeing what I post (for good or bad, remember this is not about needing page views or the like). The downside is I lose some freedom because I'm guessing I couldn't post just portraits of models that would be used in sinking shots (so you could get a good look at the whole model, although I see lots of other "pre-sink" photos by other producers so maybe this is okay provided the character does sink in a subsequent image). The thing is, I might want to use those models for something else at some point, but on DeviantArt I'd be labeled as that "quicksand guy" and I guess stigma comes with that. Then again, nearly every model I make I do want to sink and so they'd probably wind up here (I actually make a lot of models and hold off on drawing images because I'm like "you just did QS on DeviantArt and its too much" but here can we ever have too much?).

So as the relevant community, I wanted to get your thoughts. I'm still worried about a big brother watching, which is driving this, so maybe this is the safest place to be. What do you all think? Thanks for reading!

Rusty

[Boggy Man]

All of your quicksand material will be gladly welcomed here with open arms!

[Billie Bonce]

Hi Rusty!

I don't see any security concerns. DeviantART has nothing against quicksand. If you really don't care about the response, you can post your quicksand art here. My experience shows that you would get much less response here than at deviantART. The more you post at deviantART, the more response you get. The more you post here, the less response you get - it reduces to virtually zero. People get used to your stuff and silently download it without response. Only several nice guys remain to always give positive comments (PM2K is their leader, I bow low to him). I always said, and I still insist that the system of favorites on dA (as well as the system of kudos on DeepSinking) is a very good thing - you feel the support without forcing people to produce some smart comments. Another feature is that you get only positive response here, any attempt to criticize anything results in powerful chorus crying shame upon the one who criticized. Of course, it is always pleasant to hear nice words, and it is often discouraging to hear some criticism, but honestly it is the criticism that helps us to improve.

DeviantART is extremely paranoid about underage characters, but this site has the same policy.

DeviantART has policy against pornography, which is absolutely clearly specified. Some people disagree with that policy and either scream hysterically in their journals, or 'in defiance' post pictures violating those rules. Some people just don't care, some people think that porn must be anywhere in the Internet. You have mentioned AcidTester - he had pictures explicitly violating dA policy in his gallery. I don't know his reasons, but posting those pictures on dA should surely result in banning him.

So, the better place for you is defined by what you want to post.
- Quicksand peril (non-porn, no underage persons on the image) - DeepSinking, DeviantART, QuicksandFans.
- Quicksand peril (non-porn, underage persons on the image) - DeepSinking, DeviantART.
- Quicksand erotic wallow (non-porn, no underage persons on the image) - DeviantART, QuicksandFans. (May include nudity, no explicit sexual intercourse of masturbation).
- Quicksand erotic wallow (non-porn, underage persons on the image) - DeviantART. (No underage nudity, bikinis are okay, no explicit sexual intercourse of masturbation).
- Quicksand explicit porn (masturbation or sexual intercourse, no underage persons on the image) - QuicksanFans (in fact, I have one such picture on DeviantART, not too explicit, but still against the rules).
- Quicksand explicit porn (masturbation or sexual intercourse, underage persons on the image) - legally no where, but there are a lot of places in the Internet where you can post it at your own risk (but why one may want it?).

[MadMax359]

it's probably true that most people who follow you at D A are already here
but if you keep posting at D A you're going to reach some that don't know about this site, maybe don't know just how much they enjoy quicksand depictions until they come across your work

so I'd hope you continue to do both, as long as you can be comfortable there

[Duncan Edwards]

Among several very good observations by Billy -

"If you really don't care about the response, you can post your quicksand art here. My experience shows that you would get much less response here than at deviantART. The more you post at deviantART, the more response you get. The more you post here, the less response you get - it reduces to virtually zero. "

Nothing could be more true. It's not like every post has to have a pat on the back but it would be very good to know if anyone liked it, hated it, wanted more, etc. After a while you do wonder if anyone notices.

Best advice I can offer is to keep posting anywhere you can within the limits of that area until somebody makes you stop.

[Fred588]

I will reinforce what Duncan has said with respect to a low response rate here by making a comment directed at the large number of gimmes. [ A gimme is a person who sucks up free stuff and never gives ANYTHING in return.] To be specific, in the long run there is no free lunch. Those who produce, be it video, photos, manips, art work, stories, or anything else, will eventually go away if they receive nothing in return. What they receive need not be payment, at least in many cases, but can be in other forms. Just knowing that someone has noticed is likely to encourage the posting of more material. A basic principle of psychology states that "behavior that is rewarded is more likely to be repeated and behavior not rewarded is less likely to be repeated. Recognition is a form of reward.

With respect to criticism, it is my opinion that criticism based on reason (such as, "I did not like the ending because-----,") is usually fairly well received. Criticism not based on reason (such as 'that's just crap.' ) is not well received and does no one any good.

[PM2K]

Gee... now I feel bad about not commenting here more often... but I like to think I try.

Rusty, big fan of your work, and not just the quicksand stuff, either. Wherever you post, I'll follow. I will try to be more vocal about it, too.

Thanks, too, Billie for the kind words. Big fan of your work, too... especially the elves.

I know what you all mean about the lack of comments. I do have a half dozen regulars who comment on the stuff I post here - thanks, all, by the way - and I always like to hear from them, including likes/dislikes etc., as long as it is more than, like Fred said, simply saying "that's crap!"
I once got ticked at a person who felt the need to "correct" one of my manips, but I kept quiet. I think he meant well, but.... you know.

Still, I know people are paying attention. The "views" counter on my stories indicates that to an extent - and again, thanks for all those who took the time to comment, even if it is just a "good show!"
A while back, I posted a few artworks I found which were - well - ugly. A few folks pointed this out, and I had to agree with it. Sometimes one can't see the quicksand for the folks stuck in it. What struck me is the number of people who commented on that particular thread to encourage me to keep posting, and not to take the criticism personally. It showed me there are people out there watching and appreciating the effort, and that is a cool feeling, even if they aren't really vocal about it.

[water_bug_62208]

As far as I can tell, Rusty, the work you post on DeviantArt sits well within the rules of the site and can be considered "tame" compared to other "works of art" that I've come upon there. So, if you wish to post on DeviantArt, do so. And, yes, you do get additional comments there as you do have viewers who are outside of our "community" there.

And, if receiving comments is not something you seek then continue to post here on the Forum. Your artwork is certainly always welcomed and is, from what I've seen, well-received.

Personally, whether it be at DeviantArt or here, I post comments when something appeals to me, catches my attention, or intrigues me in some fashion. I've got to the point where I don't post a comment for the sake of posting a comment... if it does something for me, I'll post.

Anayway, I believe DeviantArt is still a good fit for you, and this site is as well. If posting to both sites works for you, great! If posting to only one is comfortable for you, rest assured that your fans will find you.

[Rusty Shackleford]

Thanks everyone for the thoughts and advice! I think it really says a lot of great things about this community that we can have a frank and supportive discussion here. I'm happy I've got friends here who are willing to offer their thoughts on this issue.

I'm glad to hear that I was being a little too paranoid about DeviantArt, and thanks Billie for the thorough analysis on that! I do feel, though, like I've gotten away from my roots here. I think I'm going to start a parallel thread here so I can post at both locations (at least for the time being).

I know what you all mean about the feedback issue, and I feel guilty of that myself not leaving enough comments. I agree there is nothing more valuable than some constructive criticism. I don't post because I'm looking for feedback, its more of a "I finally made something I'm proud of, let me share it with you" feeling. But it is always nice to hear that the stuff you think is good really is good, and even better when you get suggestions of how to do it better. In my case, I feel like there are just a handful of 3D artists out there and I really think we should share tips more often. I know I've gotten better because I've had conversations in the past with some folks who unfortunately no longer post anymore. Practice makes perfect, and its not like they teach quicksand art in art school!

Thank you all again, I do truly appreciate it.

Rusty