Shattered Sword Addendum

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kham
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Shattered Sword Addendum

Postby kham » Fri May 16, 2014 6:15 am

Complete with pictures :P

A half-hour of video from a couple years ago National WWII Museum Conference on WWII. Nothing terribly new, although it does give a straightforward simple explanation of what was written, and to be fair, a little complicated reading unless you were nautical or aviation minded. I think it shows the difference in thinking today, where people expect HD live surround sound footage of any sort of military confrontation, as opposed to 1942, where you can literally count the photos taken during the battle on the fingers of one hand. The pilots there were lucky to have a Brownie, never mind a proper strike camera, and also tended to be somewhat busy at the time. Almost all the clear shots taken of Kido Butai were shot from the B-17 strikes, which at 20,000 feet were more or less unmolested. It is interesting that the photographs were the impetus to dig deeper when they were researching their book, since their research guy was studying them, comparing times and matching events...and things weren't lining up with Fuchida's book at all. They were operating under the assumption that Fuchida, a well-regarded national hero, was above simple reproach. Imagine their surprise when the Japanese historian's response was the oriental equivalent of not just no, but FUCK, NO! :lol: Turned out his stuff had been discredited - harshly - for over a quarter-century. That little detail just hadn't gotten through yet. The data had always been there too, just that no one had sat down and looked at the actual flight deck records and compared that to his book. Doing that, takes about 10 min and the conclusion is drawn immediately that his stuff is pure fiction. Since the records match up precisely with photographic evidence shot independently.

If you were to take 10 people off the street and ask them, their recollection would likely be based on the 70s-era MIdway movie, which took its cues mostly from Fuchida's book. We need a new movie.

joedeep130535
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Re: Shattered Sword Addendum

Postby joedeep130535 » Fri May 16, 2014 9:36 am

It is said that history is written by the winners & I suppose that is mainly true Interesting to find one of the losing side getting his say even if it is not "history" Historical fiction perhaps

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kham
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Re: Shattered Sword Addendum

Postby kham » Fri May 16, 2014 10:05 am

Fuchida had his "say" from 1955 until about 1975, when other, JAPANESE historians, tore him into tiny bits of rice paper. That he flat-out lied to cover his own ass is likely because of some twisted notion of honor, or similar idiocy. It does no service to history, or the sailors and airmen involved. As for that victor meme, the history of the United States Navy in WWII by Samuel Elliot Morrison is probably one of the best--and impartial--histories written on any service. It calls spades out as fucking shovels when need be. There were certainly some things that could have been more blunt, but by and large it is a case study in how to get it right. The opposite, on how to NOT, would be the British and some of the treaties on the Battle of Jutland, which were flat-out dicksucking abominations to kiss Beatty's ass. The fact that his end of the battle was a colossal balls-up, AND the asshole literally ordered the historian at the time to alter his manuscript (scumbag was First Sea Lord at the time...) only compounded things. For the record, I consider Beatty an overblown, bloated scumbag who not only was unqualified for command, but a lying incompetent asshole incapable of following orders and taking responsibility for his actions. Jellicoe should have fired his ass out of a cannon after Dogger Bank, never mind Jutland.

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Mudbogz
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Re: Shattered Sword Addendum

Postby Mudbogz » Tue May 27, 2014 1:08 am

I've read about every book on the Battle of Midway, to include Fuchida's book and I have to say Shattered Sword is the most in depth account of the battle you will find. a close second would be Gordon Prange's "Miracle at Midway", which while a good, fair accounting of the battle, in retrospect didn't seem to have access to the full range of information shown in Shattered Sword. Shattered Sword is nothing short of amazing in insight and detail and is a fair look at the battle of Midway from both US and Japanese forces. Lack of intelligence, Lack of Radar and an acute lack of just plain luck doomed Kido Butai's mission to failure.

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kham
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Re: Shattered Sword Addendum

Postby kham » Tue May 27, 2014 7:27 am

When you start dissecting the reasons for the defeat, the list starts to pile up rapidly. Lack of proper staff work, lack of objective wargaming the operation (when you suffer losses in THAT and ignore it, you are not off to a good start...) failure to concentrate forces, basing the entire operation on the enemy's intentions rather than actual capabilities....on and on and on....

Yamamoto was no genius by any yardstick you'd care to employ. And made worse by the level of self-delusion the Imperial Navy continued to employ even after the battle. None of the Midway commanders were fired, or even transferred. Some (Kusaka, Ugaki, Fuchida) did the best they could and were not responsible for the disaster. But Yamamoto, and Nagumo, both kept their jobs. Kido Butai got Shokaku and Zuikaku incorporated into them and a new designation, but that was it. Now, here you have these guys, not a mark on them from the 'corporate' level, after just having presided over a debacle on par with Selamis, or Trafalgar. There is not a western navy on the planet where their opposite numbers would not have been fired at the least.

Was just looking at one of the carrier shots taken while the B-17s were attacking; Soryu, probably folks have seen this shot since it's fairly famous, the 'big circle' shot. But this one is in full-res, which means you can blow it up and peruse some details - like that aircraft on the aft part of the flight deck. The only aircraft on deck actually. Clearly a Zero, just landed or being pulled out of the wires. Which, means, they were conducting recovery operations when the bombers attacked. Cycling the CAP for more gas and ammo, ok no worries there.Which also means, they can't spot the deck. Which means, everything after this about packed decks is a cartoon....
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