Boots and quickmud

[maria]

Hi all,

I'm hoping there are a few boot lovers out there who can help answer this one.

We all read about quicksand and how it clamps around your legs and body making escape difficult. And the main substance is sand with maybe some mud. Then there's pure clay like in the quarries. But the other day I came across a place where workers had backfilled an old quarry pond.
There were some obvious looking parts that looked like pure clay, and then around the edges was dry mounded soil - it was like clay and sand mixed together.

I put my rubber boots (Hunter's) on and thought about checking it out. The dry-looking surface resisted sinking, but then my boots broke through after a bit of walking around and I sank to the boots rims fairly quickly. I didn't want to go any deeper as it was quite open to people passing by.

Time to get out I thought, but then the ground around me started to buckle and wobble. I tried lifting one boot and managed to get it half out but the other boot "glided" under. I panicked a little and instinctively tried to walk my way out, but the ground, which looked dry on top, started folding in around my legs like muddy dough and before I knew it I had sunk to my hips.

I couldn't feel anything solid at all under my boots and as I tried getting out, the ground kept rolling in around me and literally turned into thick clay. I've sunk many times in waders and boots in deep mud, but never experienced a genuine sense of feeling like I wasn't going to be able to get out. I was basically pedalling my boots in a bottomless bed of liquified ground and kept going down. It felt like it was mixed with coarser material, maybe like fine sand. I was so difficult to pull myself out and unlike anything I've experienced before. The clay was super grippy - bit hard to describe, but the picture of it on my boots when I finally dragged myself out might give a clue to its viscosity.

Here's a couple of pics of what I went down into. The sinking texture is so nice that I'd like to go and experiment in it with my waders - thigh length or chest waders. But I really don't know what might be ahead of me, kind of knowing that even the chest waders will probably go under - the rubber hip waders certainly will! And the reality of sinking, is we often can't just stop pumping our legs for the sake of safety!

Has anyone had real experiences of not being able to get out this type of mud when wearing boots or waders? I can't go accompanied by the way, so it would (if I'm brave enough) be a solo sink.

And is there such a thing as quickmud?

Thanks for helping.
Maria

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[maria]

I forgot to mention, I did run it past a special lady friend, who advised against it

[bogbud]

That place looks like a jackpot! You should definately visit it again but better sooner than later because it will not be available for long. And bring a long and stable stick!!

I hope there is a fence around it or at least some warning sings to stay off, because this is an example of a not properly filled pit at a construction site. I have read quite a number of news-reports about these mudtraps. Playing kids or people who wanted to take a shortcut are deceived by the dry looking surface and plunge right in .

This is scientifically not real "quick"mud, because the quickness comes from some underground watersource that presses the sand (or mud) upwards. I guess watery mud was just dumped into that pond way to fast. It is now in the process of drying up from the top to the bottom, that makes it thick and later super gluey at the top but keeps it very soft and dangerous deeper down for quite a long time. (Your boots(?) do look superb btw )

When the crust gets thicker, keep in mind that there is a certain risk to become stuck for good.
There is an example here (the pit itself is much more shallow, but you get an impression):
http://www.downloaddreams.com/stuck-in- ... anguage=en

[quickman]

If you wear waders I'd be afraid the stuff might go over the top and start spilling inside making it even harder to get out

[Mynock]

Congrats on finding an awesome spot! Nothing better than a clay sink imho.

If you want to go any deeper I would experiment without the waders first, just so you know what you're getting into. Settling ponds can have a very thick layer of clay near the bottom that's incredibly tenacious, if you got into that with boots or waders on you might actually be in trouble.

[maria]

Not sure if I'd want to try sinking without some form of clothing protection, that's why I almost can't resist the urge to teeter the wader rims at the point of no return - has anyone done that before and what does it feel like to be on the edge of sinking too deep?

Bogbud or any other wader people - have you had real experiences of being pulled under by waders and getting trapped? If so, how did you eventually escape?

If I took a stick - and did sink a bit to deep, is it likely I get deeper than chest deep or will I float (wearing waders)? Anyone have any good answers for someone if I had to be rescued

I was going to upload a short clip but it got rejected for some reason. So here's another pic close up of the consistency of the mud.

[maria]

Sorry, reposted wrong picture! This is just when one boot slopped up and out - it was all downwards after this!

[bogbud]

Bogbud or any other wader people - have you had real experiences of being pulled under by waders and getting trapped? If so, how did you eventually escape?

Nothing "pulls you down" in mud, except some backpack filled with stones or the like

From your photos and info that mud looks really thick and heavy. Physics will limit your sinking potential to about belly- or chest-deep then (Look up Archimedis' Principle if you want to know more). So when wearing chestwaders you should be safe as long as you don't move too much.

Of course you CAN sink way deeper and also over your head if you want to as long as the mud is soft enough to allow pumping your legs, bending your body or thrashing around. When you can't move your lower body anymore you're really stuck and in trouble. (Consider Mynocks answer, he has thick and sticky mud deep down, but my places tend to become softer when sinking deep, so do probe the spot first).

You don't have to worry about flooding your waders at all. I do regulary sink deeper than my waders (they are really tall and go right up to my armpits) and they don't really fill with mud, because there is already so much mud around you thats pressing your waders against your body. This largely limits the available room inside your waders that could be filled. I also suggest wearing a tight-fitting rainjacket over your waders for additional protection.

The stick, or some long branch of a tree gives you the chance to hold onto and you have something you can push against when you want to get out again. Keep in mind, that this will be the hard, tiring and sometimes even frustrating and scary part of a deep-sinking adventure in stuff like you have there. Look up my "sinking all the way-thread" from a couple months ago if you want to know what could possibly go wrong.

[mudxdresser]

In general, shoes and boots are more likely to hinder you getting out of thick or sandy mud than with bare feet or socks. Same applies to waders. Even pants can pose a problem if they slide partially off. The main problem is if the heavy or sandy mud gets over the top and so to speack, "locks" what you are wearing. The fact that a particular pair of shoes/boots or clothing is easy to move in while in one type of mud doesn't mean that it is safe in all mud. Have respect for the problem and if you have the opportunity, experiment safely to experience the effect and once you know what you're dealing with, you can make a better decision as to whether certain clothing or footwear is worth the risk.

Me, been there, done that which is why I usually just wear socks and a dress that can be ripped off if it becomes too heavy with mud to pull out!

[maria]

Thanks for the replies and good information. It's amazing how our love of sinking is never as straight forward as "less dirty" adventures!

I'll try and work a way of testing the mud out in chest waders … might take forever to get out as there's nothing to grab onto except the stick idea. I wonder if it would be possible to step out of the waders and leave them there in the mud - maybe pull them out later?

I'll check the thread out Bogbud, thanks.